#1491 John 8 Part 5 You Ain't 50 Yet

 

48 The Jews answered and said to Him, “Do we not say rightly that You are a Samaritan and have a demon?” 49 Jesus answered, “I do not have a demon, but I honor My Father, and you dishonor Me. 50 But I do not seek My glory; there is One who seeks and judges. 51 Truly, truly, I say to you, if anyone keeps My word he will never see death—ever.” 52 The Jews said to Him, “Now we know that You have a demon. Abraham died, and the prophets also; and You say, ‘If anyone keeps My word, he will never taste of death—ever.’ 53 Surely You are not greater than our father Abraham who died? The prophets died too; whom do You make Yourself out to be?” 54 Jesus answered, “If I glorify Myself, My glory is nothing; it is My Father who glorifies Me, of whom you say, ‘He is our God’; 55 and you have not known Him, but I know Him; and if I say that I do not know Him, I will be a liar like you, but I do know Him and keep His word. 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.” 57 So the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?” 58 Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.” 59 Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him, but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple. John 8: 48-59 LSB

John 8: 48-59

V. 48 Do we not say rightly that You are a Samaritan and have a demon - He just accused them of being the spawn of Satan based upon their fruit, and this is the response of their bruised egos. They have attacked Him for His claims to deity, but He has shown fruit that establishes as much. They have accused Him of breaking the Sabbath, but they didn't last 5 minutes in that argument, so now it's pretty much down to school yard name calling based upon other than His own character. A Samaritan was a half breed to the Jews, a people they despised and avoided. I think it is highly probable, in light of other things they said, that this is also an attack on His virgin birth, though that was also prophesied.  

…6He says: “It is not enough for You to be My Servant, to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the protected ones of Israel. I will also make You a light for the nations, to bring My salvation to the ends of the earth.” 7Thus says the LORD, the Redeemer and Holy One of Israel, to Him who was despised and abhorred by the nation, to the Servant of rulers: “Kings will see You and rise, and princes will bow down, because of the LORD, who is faithful, the Holy One of Israel, who has chosen You.” 8This is what the LORD says: “In the time of favor I will answer You, and in the day of salvation I will help You; I will keep You and appoint You to be a covenant for the people, to restore the land, to apportion its desolate inheritances,… Isaiah 49: 6-8

Spurgeon - You know this form of answer; it is an old trick, when there is no case, abuse the plaintiff. So, when there is no answer to what Christ has said, call him a Samaritan, and say that he has a devil.....Always abuse your adversary if you cannot answer him: this is always the devil’s tactic. When he cannot overthrow religion, then he seeks to append opprobrious titles to those who profess it. It is an old and stale trick, and has lost much of its force. Our Saviour did not answer the accusation of his being a Samaritan, but inasmuch as what they said about his having a devil would touch his doctrine, he answered that. - Precept Austin

NET Note on the Jews - Here the phrase refers to the Jewish people in Jerusalem who had been listening to Jesus’ teaching in the temple courts (Jn 8:20) and had initially believed his claim to be the Messiah (cf. Jn 8:31). They had become increasingly hostile as Jesus continued to teach. Now they were ready to say that Jesus was demon-possessed!... It is not clear what is meant by the charge (Samaritan and have a demon). The meaning could be “you are a heretic and are possessed by a demon.” Note that the dual charge gets one reply (John 8:49). Perhaps the phrases were interchangeable: Simon Magus (Acts 8:14–24) and in later traditions Dositheus, the two Samaritans who claimed to be sons of God, were regarded as mad, that is, possessed by demons. - Precept Austin

V. 49 I do not have a demon, but I honor My Father, and you dishonor Me - This goes back to Who He is in relation to the Father. If you don't honor the Son then you are in no way honoring the Father.

6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be 1grasped,

7 but 1aemptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.

8 Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death 1on a cross.

9 For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name,

10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth,

11 and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. Philippians 2: 6-11

V. 50 One Who seeks and judges - What did God say about Jesus? "This is My beloved Son in Whom I am well pleased." Christ didn't come into the world to judge it, it was already under judgment. He came as the answer, the Savior, but those who reject Him will face God's ultimate judgment for rejecting the One He sent. There is a practical application here for those of us who are Christ's followers; we need to pray for our enemies and not be so caught up in the injustices towards us, or what men say about us. God will judge.

There is One who (present tense - continually) seeks (zeteo) and (present tense - continually) judges (krino) - The idea is that His Father is continually seeking glory and honor for His Son. As the NLT paraphrases it "God is going to glorify me." Judges speaks of the Father's judgment between Jesus and the Jews. God’s judgment is on one hand to declare that Jesus’ is due the glory He will receive and on the other hand to condemn His accusers for rejecting Him and refusing to give Him glory. In short, God the Father seeks His Son's glory and will ultimately judge all who reject His Son. - Precept Austin

…21If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat, and if he is thirsty, give him water to drink. 22For in so doing, you will heap burning coals on his head, and the LORD will reward you. 23As the north wind brings forth rain, so a backbiting tongue brings angry looks.… Proverbs 25: 21-23

V. 51-53 Will never taste of death - Those who keep His word. They argue back from the only realm they currently know or belong to. They know of great men who died, but they also know of Elijah and Enoch. We know that Christ's Apostles all met with death, only one probably from old age. They have no comprehension of a passing on into glory, giving up this body of death that they now are in and taking hold of eternal life. 

…47Remember the briefness of my lifespan! For what futility You have created all men! 48What man can live and never see death? Can he deliver his soul from the power of Sheol? Selah 49Where, O Lord, is Your loving devotion of old, which You faithfully swore to David?… Psalm 89: 47-49

What does He mean by the phrase keeps My word (logos)? Is Jesus teaching salvation by works? Of course not. He is teaching that obedience to His Word was crucial. In John 8:30 it says they came to believe in Him as He spoke the Word. In this passage, Jesus is saying that belief is shown to be saving belief by the individual's subsequent response. If they keep His Word, they show that their heart has believed and they have a supernatural desire and power from God which enables them to keep His Word. The root is their believing His Word. The fruit is their keeping His Word. His Word would refer to all that He had spoken to them that opens the door to the Kingdom of Heaven and eternal life. - PA

V. 54 It is My Father Who glorifies Me, of Whom you say, "He is our God" - The Author of the great book, the God of the prophets to whom they refer, that is Jesus' Dad. He has stayed with this even though it is an unpopular part of His message.

20 which He brought about in Christ, when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places,

21 far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come.

22 And He put all things in subjection under His feet, and gave Him as head over all things to the church,

            23 which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all. Ephesians 1: 20-23 

V. 55 And you have not known Him - Their fruit makes it evident that they know of Him, have His words on paper, but not in their hearts, their deeds, their inability to recognize the Landowner's Son when He comes, to pay Him respect, shows they don't know the God they speak about. There is no intimacy. Faith without works is dead.

…5For we do not proclaim ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, and ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake. 6For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” made His light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. 7Now we have this treasure in jars of clay to show that this surpassingly great power is from God and not from us.… 2 Corinthians 4: 5-7

V. 56-57 Your Father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad - Notice this is in the present and past, an ongoing relationship between the Son of God and Abraham, whom these Jews hope in. The Promised One being sent to earth, this is something that Abraham longed for and now witnessed. The inheritance is through the Son, it is only fulfilled in that justice and mercy both meet in Him. Their response to this is that Jesus is not even 50 years old. They continue to not understand His very clear claims of being God's Son, from the Father, from somewhere else, brought here to be born of a virgin, become a man to be the second Adam by way of which the elect will be saved. There is no ability to ascertain spiritual things in them at all.

…10Concerning this salvation, the prophets who foretold the grace to come to you searched and investigated carefully, 11trying to determine the time and setting to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when He predicted the sufferings of Christ and the glories to follow. 12It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves, but you, when they foretold the things now announced by those who preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven. Even angels long to look into these things.… 1 Peter 1: 10-12

V. 58 Truly, truly I say to you, before Abraham was, I am - He gives the Amen, Amen before what He says, and He is placing great emphasis here, pay attention, this is foundational. Before Abraham was, before he was born, before he was given the name Abraham, before time and space, before all of your history, before the patriarchs, "I am". There are so many cults out there that say they are Christian, say they believe in Jesus, but they say He is not God, yet that is not what Jesus Himself taught. If you struggle with that I would encourage you to go back through John 1. It's important not to worship a false Christ, or preach one other than the Real Lord and Savior.

John 1 part 1 Logos

John 1 Part 2 Elohim

John 1 Part 3 Immanuel

1Now, O daughter of troops, mobilize your troops; for a siege is laid against us! With a rod they will strike the cheek of the judge of Israel. 2But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, who are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come forth for Me One to be ruler over Israel— One whose origins are of old, from the days of eternity. 3Therefore Israel will be abandoned until she who is in labor has given birth; then the rest of His brothers will return to the children of Israel.… Micah 5: 1-3

…5For every trampling boot of battle and every garment rolled in blood will be burned as fuel for the fire. 6For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given, and the government will be upon His shoulders. And He will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. 7Of the increase of His government and peace there will be no end. He will reign on the throne of David and over his kingdom, to establish and sustain it with justice and righteousness from that time and forevermore. The zeal of the LORD of Hosts will accomplish this.… Isaiah 9: 5-7

…16For in Him all things were created, things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together. 18And He is the head of the body, the church; He is the beginning and firstborn from among the dead, so that in all things He may have preeminence.… Colossians 1: 16-18

…10And: “In the beginning, O Lord, You laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands. 11They will perish, but You remain; they will all wear out like a garment. 12You will roll them up like a robe; like a garment they will be changed; but You remain the same, and Your years will never end.”… Hebrews 1: 10-12

…13Then Moses asked God, “Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ and they ask me, ‘What is His name?’ What should I tell them?” 14God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I AM has sent me to you.’” 15God also told Moses, “Say to the Israelites, ‘The LORD, the God of your fathers—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob—has sent me to you.’ This is My name forever, and this is how I am to be remembered in every generation.… Exodus 3: 13-15

Spurgeon - Here he claims his Deity to the fullest extent, and those who can read the New Testament, and profess to believe it, and yet not see Christ as a claimant of Deity, must be sinfully blind.....They had asked him, “Whom makest thou thyself?” and now they have his answer: “Before Abraham was, I am,” saith Christ. It is the very name by which God revealed himself to Moses at the burning bush, “I AM.” Yet Jesus takes this title to himself: “Before Abraham was,” — not, “I was;” notice that; but, “I am;” as if his life was one continued present existence, as indeed it is, for with God there is no past or future, but all things are ever-present to his infinite mind. When Jesus said, “Before Abraham was, I am,” he claimed the Godhead, he declared that he was certainly God, self-existent from all eternity. - PA quoting C. H. Spurgeon

#1490 John 8 Part 4 Truth Or Dare

 

31 So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, “If you abide in My word, then you are truly My disciples; 32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” 33 They answered Him, “We are Abraham’s seed and have never yet been enslaved to anyone. How is it that You say, ‘You will become free’?”

34 Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin. 35 And the slave does not remain in the house forever; the son does remain forever. 36 So if the Son makes you free, you will be free indeed. 37 I know that you are Abraham’s seed; yet you are seeking to kill Me, because My word has no place in you. 38 I speak the things which I have seen with My Father; therefore you also do the things which you heard from your father.”

39 They answered and said to Him, “Abraham is our father.” Jesus *said to them, “If you are Abraham’s children, you would do the deeds of Abraham. 40 But now you are seeking to kill Me, a man who has told you the truth, which I heard from God. This Abraham did not do. 41 You are doing the deeds of your father.” They said to Him, “We were not born of sexual immorality; we have one Father: God.” 42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and have come from God, for I have not even come of Myself, but He sent Me. 43 Why do you not understand what I am saying? It is because you cannot hear My word. 44 You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies. 45 But because I speak the truth, you do not believe Me. 46 Which one of you convicts Me of sin? If I speak truth, why do you not believe Me? 47 He who is of God hears the words of God; for this reason you do not hear them, because you are not of God.” John 8: 31-47

John 8: 31-47

V. 31 If you abide in My word, then you are truly My disciples - This, Jesus is saying to those, who in the last segment, "came to believe in Him". I got kind of excited when I saw that they believed in Him, but remembering also that I read ahead for context, that excitement was short lived. I grew up in the time of mega churches, the continuation of the Jesus movement, the word Christian used as an adjective before all manner of things. We had big Christian book stores with lots of books, but mostly by people who had terrible theology, who believed more in the wisdom and psychology of this world, who played to people's earthly, temporal wants. We had so called Christian music by people who turned out to be not so Christian, with words that had little to do with sound doctrine. We had a lot of Christian theatre, Christian entertainment, youth groups, parties, even the pizza and tacos were Christian, but by whose definition? Many of us were apostate in our understanding of Christ and the gospel, many of us turned to the allure of the world, and walked away, not sure what we were walking away from. I didn't have a love for God's word or His people, only for "Cool Christians" who were actually just enablers. Jesus is in no way eliminating Justification by Grace alone, through Faith alone, In Christ Alone, according to Scripture alone, but what He is saying is the same as saying, "a tree is known by it's fruit." Those that are truly His will continue with Him, hating what He hates and loving what He loves. 

…22But now He has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy, unblemished, and blameless in His presence— 23if indeed you continue in your faith, established and firm, not moved from the hope of the gospel you heard, which has been proclaimed to every creature under heaven, and of which I, Paul, have become a servant. Colossians 1: 22-23

…15Be diligent in these matters and absorbed in them, so that your progress will be evident to all. 16Pay close attention to your life and to your teaching. Persevere in these things, for by so doing you will save both yourself and those who hear you. 1 Timothy 4: 15-16

V. 32 And you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free - Here is a beautiful selection from J Mac on this:

And oh, by the way, most of the philosophers and psychologists and cynics would agree that there is no real, absolute truth. Truth is whatever you want it to be; there’s no objective, absolute truth. Truth is whatever you want to be truth for your well-being. Be true to your own truth, and you’ll be free from the kinds of things that torture your own psyche.

The problem with objective truth and the problem with absolute truth is it’s very uncomfortable, because absolute truth and objective truth raises your moral responsibility. And you really don’t want that, not in a hedonistic culture. Increasing your moral obligation, increasing your moral responsibility doesn’t feel like freedom.

“The truth shall make you free” has also found its way into academia. It is the statement of California Institute of Technology—Caltech. They adopted “The truth shall make you free” back in 1925. And since 1925, that really hasn’t worked out too well in the scientific world, because if you read recent articles written by Caltech scientists, they will tell you that no longer is science driven by a search for the truth, it is basically driven by a grant from the political party in power. And consequently, science has given way to politics. So whatever the search for truth once was, back in 1925, it is now completely compromised by politics.

And then there is the government itself. If you were to see the original building of the CIA, you would see carved on the front of that building, “The truth shall make you free.” And we all are pretty convinced that the CIA would not be a good place to go to find the truth. They have been so utterly compromised by the politics and the ideologies of our culture. They would be assumed to be, at one point in our history, the protectors of all that is true and right and good. But they have been corrupted by the rest of the corruption that they can’t escape.

There’s, then, political and social freedom. “The truth shall make you free.” How does that work out in our society? I’m not a social critic, as you know, but I think there might be a perspective that will help you, as we talk a little bit about these sort of temporal, earthly perspectives on freedom.

Back in 1932 a devout atheist by the name of Aldous Huxley wrote Brave New World. Brave New World was a dystopian novel that looked at the future and assumed that it wouldn’t be very long before the West was completely captive to totalitarianism—that is rule by a dominant force, where you have only two classes: the ruling class and all the people who are subjected to them. In Brave New World, he portrayed what life would be like.

It was about seventeen years later that George Orwell, another devout atheist, wrote 1984, another dystopian novel that looked at the future. And just examining those recently in my own thoughts, I drew out of those two pictures of totalitarianism in the future of the West, what are pretty amazing, prescient insights from a couple of atheists. Totalitarian rule, both of them say, is essentially the absolute political-social slavery of everyone. We are used to what is called chattel slavery. C-H-A-T-T-E-L. Chattel slavery is when one person owns another person; political slavery is when the state owns everybody—but the effect on the individual is identical. We have come to the place in American history where we hate chattel slavery. In fact we’ve created a massive movement, racial movement, now, based upon past chattel slavery. People rise to noble heights to condemn chattel slavery, while at the same time they are willingly becoming slaves of the state. And the end is exactly the same: Somebody owns you, and you give up your freedom.

Now what elements of society and politics produce this willing kind of state slavery? Drawing from both Orwell and Huxley, this is what they say totalitarianism would look like. Here are the necessary elements. One: a crisis. A crisis puts freedom in danger because a crisis elevates government control. And the more severe the crisis, and the more control the government gets, the more freedoms begin to disappear.

Secondly, the collective is more important than the individual. The greater good is the good of society, not your good. “We don’t care what you want or what you think, we’ve got to stop global warming. We don’t care what your freedoms are, the things that you desire and you want, you can’t say that; you can’t believe that; you can’t do that.” Because the collective is far more important than the individual. “The advance of the LGBTQ is far more important on the social side for the good of society than anything you think about that.” So the collective dominates the individual. Everybody is forced into the collective.

Thirdly, you need a mass psychosis. You need a mass psychosis, something that makes everybody afraid—like a plague, like a pandemic, like masks—that create a greater threat than the giving up of freedom. People rushed into giving up their freedoms when there was a threat that created a mass psychosis. Keep up the deception so they continue to believe the lies, and you escalate control.

Number four: Control information. Control what people hear, what they therefore believe. And the way to control information is the following: Create confusion, send out all kinds of diverse signals so that nothing is really clear. So you’re creating a kind of acceptable irrationality, a kind of madness. Censor what you don’t want; control people by technology and media.

Number five—and this is a dominant feature of both of these novels: hedonism. Turn loose all kinds of immorality everywhere. Create a situation of unhindered sexual lust. Let people be completely lost in pleasure, no boundaries on any kind of sexual behavior. Fill the culture with pornography, because as long as they are unhindered in their sexual lusts, as long as they are lost in hedonistic pleasure, they’re not thinking.

Number six: Feed them mindless, accessible, irrelevant, distracting, nonstop entertainment—so they live in a world of fantasy and emotional stimulation rather than thought. Number seven: Make drugs available to everyone because drugged people, or drunk people, are harmless. And number eight—this is critical: If you want to take over an entire population, isolate them from each other—because when you isolate them from each other, you control the narrative. You take them away from the examples of something different. That is what atheists came up with as the pathway to dystopian totalitarianism, in which people distracted, dumbed-down, drugged, give up their freedoms.

Now what is the biggest threat to this? The biggest threat to this is pretty simple: Some other authority than the government. And by the way, don’t look to politicians to fix this; they’re the problem. They’re the powerful; they’re not going to fix this. One non-politician tried to fix it, but he couldn’t get any help from all the politicians. You can’t turn to them to fix it, they’re the powerful; they’re the elite, power-hungry people who just want more power.

What is the threat to them? Another authority—in fact, another authority that is a greater authority, that is a transcendent authority, that is an eternal authority, and that has revealed Himself clearly on the pages of Holy Scripture. So who is their greatest enemy? God. What is the book that they most fear? The Bible.

I don’t know what freedom in this Western culture in the future looks like. But I see all of this shaping up—and this is from, as I said, back in 1930 to 1940s. But we certainly have managed to check off all the boxes—right?—to create totalitarianism. And here we are, so nobly upset about the freedom that was taken away from slaves in the past, while at the same time—dumbed down, stupidly, mindlessly, lustfully—we give up all our freedoms and become slaves of the state, and the end is exactly the same.

But when we talk about “The truth shall make you free,” psychology fails, psychology fails. You’re just playing mind games with yourself. Philosophy fails, because the truth is not in you. There’s no value in being cynical and believing that truth doesn’t exist because no objective, absolute truth exists. The educational system in the universities fail. Science fails because it gets corrupted. And the government, the government—when the government fails—and the government does fail—then the tale is told, because they’re in charge. So whatever it means, “The truth shall make you free” has nothing to do with any of these things I’ve been talking about, because they’re all corrupted. We’re talking about something different. J Mac Sermon "The Truth Shall Set You Free"

V. 33 We are Abraham's seed and have never been enslaved to anyone - Well that's pretty inaccurate, so delusional, and exactly what we would expect a lost person to say. Physically they had been slaves to Egypt where God had brought them out of bondage from. The northern kingdom became slaves to Assyria, Judah to Babylon, then Persia, Greece, and now Rome. Jesus is talking to them of spiritual matters, those things bearing eternal weight, that they are slaves to sin. Some may even get that He is saying that, but it's offensive to them. Pride always says you are in the right and plays down the truth. My pride told me that I could be an atheist when I was young, and to not worry, because if that turned out to be wrong then I had walked the aisle at church when I was young, had said a prayer and was baptized. I had a "backup plan", so to speak, but that was also lost and delusional. 

Answered Him, "We (present tense - continually) are Abraham's descendants (sperma) - The assert their spiritual superiority as children of Abraham. They are likely thinking of OT blessings of being Abraham's descendants like Ps 105:6 "O seed of Abraham, His servant, O sons of Jacob, His chosen ones!" Or Isa 41:8 "But you, Israel, My servant, Jacob whom I have chosen, Descendant of Abraham My friend" Their descent from Abraham was the source of their pride and their confidence regarding their salvation. John the Baptist had warned them not to place their confidence in their physical heritage (Lk 3:8). The implication is that they have no need of a Savior since they consider themselves children of Abraham. They had no sense of their bondage to sin, so had no need for a Savior! - Precept Austin

V. 34-38 Everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin - This is the reality, not your truth, not my truth, but the truth as God states it. It's simple, you belong to what you serve. They called God their Lord, Abraham their Father, but they served their flesh, the beckoning of the devil, "hast God said?" If Jesus is Lord the evidence is that you do what He says, and the reverse is also true. Plenty of people had Abraham's genetics but not his relationship with the Lord. You can actually see this grow in Him over time, that he came to believe the God he believed in. Others, like Ahab, were even kings to the Jews, descending from the same lines, but being slaves to sin, believing lies rather than taking God at His word. You would think Christ is giving them some new teaching, but it is an old one.

25(Surely there was never one like Ahab, who sold himself to do evil in the sight of the LORD, incited by his wife Jezebel. 26He committed the most detestable acts by going after idols, just like the Amorites whom the LORD had driven out before the Israelites.)… 1 Kings 21: 25-26

…21For a man’s ways are before the eyes of the LORD, and the LORD examines all his paths. 22The iniquities of a wicked man entrap him; the cords of his sin entangle him. 23He dies for lack of discipline, led astray by his own great folly.… Proverbs 5: 21-23

…5For if we have been united with Him like this in His death, we will certainly also be united with Him in His resurrection. 6We know that our old self was crucified with Him so that the body of sin might be rendered powerless, that we should no longer be slaves to sin. 7For anyone who has died has been freed from sin.… Romans 6: 5-7

V. 39 If you were Abraham's children you would do the deeds of Abraham - Yikes, with God one can't just say, "I am a son, a father, a brother, a mother", no, you have to reflect that. I have a godly mother, but I was in no way a reflection of that for most of my life. She was repentant and hurt over sin, I justified mine. She read the word of God and prayed every day about what she read. I figured I knew enough from my years of Sunday School, and I was baptized. God looks at the heart, He looks for fruit, and He is not buying what these people are selling. 

…28A man is not a Jew because he is one outwardly, nor is circumcision only outward and physical. 29No, a man is a Jew because he is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man’s praise does not come from men, but from God. Romans 2: 28-29

6It is not as though God’s word has failed. For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel. 7Nor because they are Abraham’s descendants are they all his children. On the contrary, “Through Isaac your offspring will be reckoned.” 8So it is not the children of the flesh who are God’s children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as offspring.… Romans 9: 6-8

V. 40 This Abraham did not do - The guy you say you are from, that you are like according to the flesh, well, he didn't go around killing people for telling the truth.

12 not as Cain, who was of the evil one and slew his brother. And for what reason did he slay him? Because his deeds were evil, and his brother’s were righteous.

13 Do not be surprised, brethren, if the world hates you.

14 We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death.

15 Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer; and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3: 12-15

V. 41-42 If God were your Father you would love Me - He also says, "I and the Father are One", He is the eternally begotten Son of God, and He has come from the Father. It is interesting in verse 41 that they mention that they weren't born of sexual immorality because that is exactly what their Scribes will say about Jesus in later writings, accusing His mother of sexual sin. They will do this, but since so many witnessed His miracles, they will also have to make up a story for that as well. The story is that He basically went to sorcery school in Egypt, that's how He learned the art of raising people from the dead, making thousands of pounds of food from a few fish and loaves, healing countless multitudes of everything from fever to being paralyzed. The blind see, the death hear, but these people do neither. Like He said before, they are going to die in their sins, but their answer back is that this is not possible because they are genetically related to Abraham.

David Thompson - “We were not born of fornication.” They are actually implying that Jesus was born because of an immoral relationship between Joseph and Mary. This verse changed the life of one of the great Bible teachers. He said he used to believe that it was possible for a person to be saved and not believe in the virgin birth. He said - I do not believe that anymore. If a person is really right with God, he will embrace all truth about Jesus Christ.

Steven Cole - There could be a couple of things behind that comment. It could be a subtle slur against Jesus’ birth, alluding to the fact that His mother conceived Him out of wedlock. Rumors about Mary’s pregnancy with Jesus had circulated for decades. So the Jews may be putting Jesus down by saying, “You’re illegitimate because Your mother was immoral, but we’re not!” Or, it could be an assertion that they were not like Gentile idolaters. Often idolatry in the Old Testament is described as spiritual adultery. So the Jews’ retort here could mean, “We were not born like idolatrous Gentiles; rather, as Jews, God is our Father.” (True and False Children of God)

Bob Utley - This may be connected with the accusation of v. 48 (“you are a Samaritan”). It seems that the Jews were asserting that Jesus was an illegitimate son, not a full blooded Jew. Later rabbinical sources would say Jesus was fathered by a Roman soldier. - Precept Austin

45The good man brings good things out of the good treasure of his heart, and the evil man brings evil things out of the evil treasure of his heart. For out of the overflow of the heart, the mouth speaks. 46 Why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ but not do what I say? 47I will show you what he is like who comes to Me and hears My words and acts on them:… Luke 6: 45-47

V. 44 You are of your father the Devil - This would be infuriating to them. The reason they want to kill Him is because that is what the Devil has always wanted; he was a murderer and they emulate him. Here again we have the fruit defining what tree it is, not what it says it is, but what it actually is. 

14So the LORD God said to the serpent: “Because you have done this, cursed are you above all livestock and every beast of the field! On your belly will you go, and dust you will eat, all the days of your life. 15And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your seed and her seed. He will crush your head, and you will strike his heel.” Genesis 3: 14-15

1And a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed in the sun, with the moon under her feet and a crown of twelve stars on her head. 2 She was pregnant and crying out in the pain and agony of giving birth. 3Then another sign appeared in heaven: a huge red dragon with seven heads, ten horns, and seven royal crowns on his heads.…

…4His tail swept a third of the stars from the sky, tossing them to the earth. And the dragon stood before the woman who was about to give birth, ready to devour her child as soon as she gave birth. 5And she gave birth to a son, a male child, who will rule all the nations with an iron scepter. And her child was caught up to God and to His throne. 6And the woman fled into the wilderness, where God had prepared a place for her to be nourished for 1,260 days.… Revelation 12: 1-6

V. 45 But because I speak the truth you do not believe Me - They really had no desire for the truth because it would contradict the very essence what they were and wanted to believe. 

…3For your hands are stained with blood, and your fingers with iniquity; your lips have spoken lies, and your tongue mutters injustice. 4No one calls for justice; no one pleads his case honestly. They rely on empty pleas; they tell lies; they conceive mischief and give birth to iniquity. 5They hatch the eggs of vipers and weave a spider’s web. Whoever eats their eggs will die; crack one open, and a viper is hatched.… Isaiah 59: 3-5

…3For the time will come when men will not tolerate sound doctrine, but with itching ears they will gather around themselves teachers to suit their own desires. 4So they will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. 5But you, be sober in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.… 2 Timothy 4: 3-5

#1489 John 8 Part 3 Too Harsh For Today

 

21 Then He said again to them, “I am going away, and you will seek Me, and will die in your sin. Where I am going, you cannot come.” 22 So the Jews were saying, “Surely He will not kill Himself, since He says, ‘Where I am going, you cannot come’?” 23 And He was saying to them, “You are from below, I am from above. You are of this world, I am not of this world. 24 Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins. For unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.” 25 So they were saying to Him, “Who are You?” Jesus said to them, “What have I been saying to you from the beginning? 26 I have many things to say and to judge concerning you, but He who sent Me is true; and the things which I heard from Him, these I am saying to the world.” 27 They did not know that He had been speaking to them about the Father. 28 So Jesus said, “When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am He, and I do nothing from Myself, but I speak these things as the Father taught Me. 29 And He who sent Me is with Me; He has not left Me alone, for I always do the things that are pleasing to Him.” 30 As He was speaking these things, many believed in Him. John 8: 21-30 LSB

John 8: 21-30

…16“Look now,” they said to Elisha, “we your servants have fifty valiant men. Please let them go and search for your master. Perhaps the Spirit of the LORD has taken him up and put him on one of the mountains or in one of the valleys.” “Do not send them,” Elisha replied. 17But when they pressed him to the point of embarrassment, he said, “Send them.” And they sent fifty men, who searched for three days but did not find Elijah. 18When they returned to Elisha, who was staying in Jericho, he said to them, “Didn’t I tell you not to go?”… 2 Kings 2: 16-18

V. 21 I am going away, and you will seek Me, and will die in your sin - He has been telling them for quite some time where He is from, that He came down from heaven, that God is His Father. They reject this about Him, even though He has fortified His claims by doing things that only God can do, healing the sick, making food enough to feed multitudes, the blind see, the lame walk, and He knows the Word of God in a way they do not. They will come to Him for certain types of miracles, but not for the spiritual rebirth. He is telling men who think they are good by their own measure that that is not the way God measures. God only accepts the works of His Son, and He only accepts us in Christ. The door is closing for these people, and they are the hardest to convince since they are religious and think themselves arrived, but without Jesus they are bound to die in their sin, to face the just wrath of an infinite Being. If only men preached like this today, they say they want to be like Jesus, well here it is, go ahead, I dare you. Tell people they aren't good enough, tell them they are going to hell. 

Hendriksen writes "In their death they will experience no comfort and no peace of any kind, only dark despair. The One whom they have rejected will not be present to help them in their need. In their sin—all their sins viewed collectively, but separately in verse 24 (sins)—they will die. The wrath of God resting upon them, they will go to the place of everlasting perdition. They cannot go where Jesus is going; namely, to the Father." (BORROW Exposition of the Gospel according to John - Chapters 7-21)

J C Ryle on you will seek (zeteo) Me and will die (apothnesko) in your sin (hamartia) - This means that His hearers would seek Him too late, having discovered too late that He was the Messiah whom they ought to have received. But the door of mercy would then be shut. They would seek in vain, because they had not known the day of their visitation. And the result would be that many of them would die miserably “in their sins,”—with their sins upon them unpardoned and unforgiven. - Precept Austin

…17“Son of man, I have made you a watchman for the house of Israel. Whenever you hear a word from My mouth, give them a warning from Me. 18If I say to the wicked man, ‘You will surely die,’ but you do not warn him or speak out to warn him from his wicked way to save his life, that wicked man will die in his iniquity, and I will hold you responsible for his blood. 19But if you warn a wicked man and he does not turn from his wickedness and his wicked way, he will die in his iniquity, but you will have saved yourself.… Ezekiel 3: 17-19

1And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2in which you used to walk when you conformed to the ways of this world and of the ruler of the power of the air, the spirit who is now at work in the sons of disobedience. 3All of us also lived among them at one time, fulfilling the cravings of our flesh and indulging its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature children of wrath.… Ephesians 2: 1-3

V. 22 Surely He will not kill Himself - They don't listen, they are the ones trying to kill Him. In Jewish thought, of that time, suicide was one of the worst sins a man could commit. It really makes a spectacle of what transpired in Judas after he betrayed Christ. Judas was seeking power, riches and comfort, and he must have had the same cultural aversion to suicide, yet so much was his despair that he hung himself, and eventually his bowels burst forth upon the potter's field. So confident are these Pharisees in their own works, in their relation to Abraham, that they don't even entertain the possibility of themselves being outside of the Kingdom, of dying in their sins. It's much easier to believe that Jesus is the sinner, that they won't be able to follow Him because He is going to hell. 

Surely He will not kill (apokteino) Himself, will He, since He says, 'Where I am going, you cannot come" - NLT - "The people asked, "Is he planning to commit suicide?" (Jn 8:22NLT). They are mocking Him and their question expects a negative answer. The sense of their response seems to be "If we can’t go where you are going you must have suicide in mind.” The Jews again (either willfully consciously or ignorantly) totally missed the point that Jesus was going to heaven and they were on a fast track to hell. They believed that those who commit suicide are excluded from eternal life according to Jewish tradition. Since they thought they were going to heaven, they reasoned that if He killed Himself, He would be sent to the worst part of Sheol, which Jews of that day thought was reserved for those who committed suicide. Josephus recorded the belief that "while the souls of those whose hands have acted madly against themselves, are received by the darkest place in Hades." (Jewish Wars iii.375) - Precept Austin

…5They cried out to You and were set free; they trusted in You and were not disappointed. 6But I am a worm and not a man, scorned by men and despised by the people. 7All who see me mock me; they sneer and shake their heads:… Psalm 22: 5-7

1Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off every encumbrance and the sin that so easily entangles, and let us run with endurance the race set out for us. 2Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before Him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God. 3Consider Him who endured such hostility from sinners, so that you will not grow weary and lose heart.… Hebrews 12: 1-3

V. 23 You are from below, I am from above - Even if they don't say it loudly enough for Him to audibly hear it, He knows the contentions of every heart. He kindly and firmly clarifies it for them, and this is the gospel, that you were born dead in your trespasses and sins, that you are part of this fallen world, dead in Adam, and here is the second Adam, someone from above. He is making it clear that they belong to what's below, to the prince of the power of the air, to those that make their bed in hell. They are only concerned with the temporal. 

…21But since he has no root, he remains for only a season. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, he quickly falls away. 22 The seed sown among the thorns is the one who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke the word, and it becomes unfruitful. 23But the seed sown on good soil is the one who hears the word and understands it. He indeed bears fruit and produces a crop—a hundredfold, sixtyfold, or thirtyfold.”… Matthew 13: 21-23

…46The spiritual, however, was not first, but the natural, and then the spiritual. 47The first man was of the dust of the earth, the second man from heaven. 48As was the earthly man, so also are those who are of the earth; and as is the heavenly man, so also are those who are of heaven.… 1 Corinthians 15: 46-48

15Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 16For all that is in the world— the desires of the flesh, the desires of the eyes, and the pride of life— is not from the Father but from the world. 17The world is passing away, along with its desires; but whoever does the will of God remains forever.… 1 John 2: 15-17

V. 24 For unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins - He keeps reiterating this; maybe it's important. 

Alas! that the farthest end of all our thoughts should be the thought of our ends.

--Thomas Adams

You believe (pisteuo) that I am (see note on ego eimi) He, (note "He" is not in Greek) you will die (apothnesko) in your sins (hamartia) - Believe is in the aorist tense calling for them to make a definite act of faith. The active voice speaks of making a volitional choice, a choice of one's will. Jesus explains the divine escape clause which is simply to believe that He is the great "I Am." Obviously implicit in this belief is acknowledgement that they are sinners in need of Him as Savior and that if they received/believed, He would be their Substitute and taste death in their place giving them eternal life. There is clearly a warning "unless" or "if you don't" for if you don't believe the door to the day of grace may be shut. And no man knows when God in His omniscience and justice deems it is time to shut that door in an individual's life. It behooves these Jews (and all souls) to walk through this door labeled "unless." The consequence to fail to believe is to receive the wages of sin which is death forever in one's sins. - PA

“You cannot repent too soon, because you do not know how soon it may be too late.”

-- Thomas Fuller

26 For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,

27 but a terrifying expectation of judgment and the fury of a fire which will consume the adversaries.

28 Anyone who has set aside the Law of Moses dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.

29 How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has insulted the Spirit of grace? Hebrews 10: 26-29

V. 25 Who are You - It has to feel like the movie Ground Hog Day to Jesus by now. He has said Who He is, that He and the Father are One, that He comes from the Father, that He only does what He sees the Father doing. He has demonstrated Who He is by many miracles and fulfillment of prophecy. 

38nor does His word abide in you, because you do not believe the One He sent. 39You pore over the Scriptures because you presume that by them you possess eternal life. These are the very words that testify about Me, 40yet you refuse to come to Me to have life.… John 5: 38-40

V. 26 To judge concerning you - They will be judged according to the light they have received.

47 “If anyone hears My sayings and does not keep them, I do not judge him; for I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world.

48 “He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day.

49 “For I did not speak 1on My own initiative, but the Father Himself who sent Me has given Me a commandment as to what to say and what to speak.

50 “I know that His commandment is eternal life; therefore the things I speak, I speak just as the Father has told Me.” John 12: 47-50

V. 27 They did not know that He had been speaking to them about the Father - Interesting, since earlier they wanted to kill Him for calling God His Father, making Himself equal to God. 

Jesus conclusion regarding the Jews points out their deep spiritual blindness. The religious men were like Paul described as those "whose case the god of this world (Satan) has blinded the minds of the unbelieving so that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God." (2Co 4:4+) These religious men were natural men who "did not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to (them); and (they) cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised." (1Co 2:14+) Unless the Lord opens eyes, none of us can see God's spiritual truths.  - PA

V. 28 When you lift up the Son of Man then you will know that I am He - Even as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up. 

…12The law, however, is not based on faith; on the contrary, “The man who does these things will live by them.” 13Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us. For it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree.” 14He redeemed us in order that the blessing promised to Abraham would come to the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.… Galatians 3: 12-14

V. 30 As He was speaking these things many believed in Him - Jesus will challenge the depths of this belief in the next verses. If you could just stop here and look no further you might leave with a warm feeling, and at most churches they would, but we are to press further and look for fruit, in our lives, our children's, and those of our church family. What did you actually believe?

J C Ryle on John 8:30 - There is, however, no reason to think that the “belief” here was anything more than a head belief that our Lord was the Messiah. That many did so believe whose hearts remained unchanged, there can be little doubt. The same expression occurs at Jn 10:42, and Jn 11:45, and Jn 12:42. The extent to which men may be intellectually convinced of the truth of religion, and know their duty, while their hearts are unrenewed, and they continue in sin, is one of the most painful phenomena in the history of human nature. Let us never be content with believing things to be true, without a personal laying bold on the living Person, Christ Jesus, and actually following Him. Chrysostom observes: “They believed, yet not as they ought, but carelessly and by chance, being pleased and refreshed by the humility of the words. For that they had not perfect faith, the Evangelist shows by their speeches after this, in which they insult Him again.” Theophylact, Zwingle, and Calvin take the same view. (John 8 Commentary) (Bolding added)

A W Pink on John 8:30 - This does not mean that they believed to the saving of their souls, the verses which follow evidence they had not. Probably nothing more is here signified than that they were momentarily impressed so that their enmity against Him was, temporarily, allayed. Many were evidently struck by what they observed in the demeanor of Christ-bearing the perverseness of His enemies so patiently, speaking of so ignominious a death with such holy composure, and expressing so positively His sense of the Father’s approbation. Nevertheless, the impression was but a fleeting one, and their believing on Him amounted to no more than asking, "When Christ cometh, will he do more miracles than these which this man hath done?" (John 7:31 ). (Bolding added) - Precept Austin